Beckett Grading Services - or as commonly known, BGS - has emerged as the most-recognized name in the industry for its objective card grading services. They have really stepped up their game too., Quick and cost less vs PSA/BGS whats not to like here?, If it was up to me and not my wife we would ONLY use SGC does anyone know a good divorce lawyer?, SGC has the best looking slabs, the fastest time (my, came back in 1 week), and cost the least amount of the three? The concept of grading cards did not take off at first, as most people believed it was just some form of the latest scam. (In fact, the Beckett Grading Scale and SGC Grading Scale are the most similar of the trio). Autograph encapsulation discounts will be available as well, including a $40 Funko Encapsulation special for the authentication and encapsulation of autographed vinyl figure boxes with an original authentication fee of $35 or less. All prices are per card. The company noted it will not have any paper/carbon copy forms available for use at the booth and will not be accepting drop-off submissions for any take-home service levels. If you opt for subgrades, you will receive an overall grade and individual grades for centering, edges, corners, and surface. It was there that began preparing baseball card price guides, which he initially offered free upon request. Kunal Chopra was hired as CEO of Dallas-based Beckett Collectibles and Beckett Group in . And when I come across those slabs, I really have to pause before buying. Reserved Right. Elite members will still receive a 10 percent discount on grading for those submissions. Its PSA authenticated but my problem with it is they rushed the authentication. Theyre seen as the best choice for many older cards, partly because of the work theyve done in the past. (any items requiring letters of authenticity will have those mailed approximately 3-4 weeks after the event). In the ordinary course of its operations, Beckett Grading (i) compiles data regarding each item submitted for grading/authentication, including, but not limited to, data relating to the identity, production, condition and grade of the item (the Data); and (ii) may take, or have taken, one or more digital or other types of photographs, images or reproductions of each such item (collectively, the Images). And you have plenty of other ways to alter beyond just trimming. Garnett, 62, is one of those who was the first to get a prominent card graded. Beckett reserves the right to find ineligible any Participant in the Program at its sole discretion. Sometimes the difference in one grade is 1000s of dollars, Garnett explained over our very long interview session. I give up. We might see more and more people off-loading those valuable pieces of cardboard with nice, high grades on them, in order to make ends meet. Nobody wanted the stuff. Corners Some cards can be trimmed to boost the value artificially, and its a standard method of alteration. Apply a 20% discount on any card Grading on your purchase using this code at Beckett Media CODE L20 Show Coupon Code 10% OFF Save Up to 10% with Code Receive up to 10% off your order at beckett.com with coupon code. Qualified Referrals. Read our Cookie Policy. Mostly, it is done for the purpose of sharpening the corners, to thus improve the authenticators grade. They give each attribute a grade of 1-10, then . Ross and I believe that they do. I have no idea what that company is, Ross said. I like they are a trusted name once someone like me wants to resale. What kind of cards does Beckett Grading grade? And I think that as the price discrepancy and the turnaround times continue to widen, they become a more obvious choice to long-term and incoming collectors.. Just depends on the cards that we are getting graded., I prefer to use PSA. The fee structure for take-home submissions will be the same as normal. Certify and protect your signed collectibles with Beckett Authentication Services, featuring special protective measures you can only get right here. Surface The quality of the surface. That line is for all you Adam Smith people out there. The benefits of subgrades, autograph grades and a superior capsule, make Beckett our choice for grading. Trimming is the practice of slightly cutting a card so that one can minimally alter the width and or height. Many older cards are poorly centered, so its one to look out for! I feel like Beckett never quite capitalized on its name in the grading realm, said Ross. In 2019, the largest seller of cards on eBay, PWCC,was caught up in a trimming scandal, having sold millions of dollars worth of cards that were allegedly altered fraudulently. One difference there, more than likely were just going to be taking submissions coming back to Dallas for the Premium and Express services. BGS will have full-service capabilities at The National, including auto authentication with letters and certificates of authentication (COAs) and encapsulation of standard sized items. Sports Card Investing: Maximize Portfolio Returns (Ultimate Guide), 10 Best Football Card Packs to Buy in 2023, In-Depth Sports Card Market Trends and Statistics (2023). Other rules apply, as listed on the submission form. A Qualified Referral occurs when: i. Trading card prices are in a boom town right now, but anyone who remembers the junk wax era will tell you- dont always believe the hype. Pretty cool option Beckett should look into having this option at local card shows in major cities. Mike S. Kansas City, MO, I would rate Beckett grading services a solid 9 out of 10. Beckett. On-site Grading - Approximate one-day (24-hour) grading will be available at some of the shows listed above. We use cookies to help personalize content, tailor and measure ads, and provide a safer experience. In other words, poor centering will drag the overall rating down, even if the card is perfect in every other way. Beckett Grading Service & Beckett Authentication Service, The International Centre, 6900 Airport Rd, Thursday 20th of April 2023 09:00 AM - 5:30 PM, Friday 21st of April 2023 09:00 AM - 5:30 PM, Saturday 22nd of April 2023 09:00 AM - 5:30 PM, Sunday 23rd of April 2023 09:00 AM - 5:30 PM, Sportsworld, 184 Broadway (Godfrieds Plaza), Wednesday 26th of April 2023 11:00 AM - 4:00 PM, Friday 28th of April 2023 12:00 PM - 7:00 PM, Saturday 29th of April 2023 09:00 AM - 5:00 PM, Sunday 30th of April 2023 10:00 AM - 4:00 PM, Santa Clara Convention Center Hall A, 5001 Great America Parkway, The Dulles Expo Center, 4320 Chantilly Shopping Center, Friday 23rd of June 2023 03:00 PM - 8:00 PM, Saturday 24th of June 2023 09:00 AM - 5:00 PM, Sunday 25th of June 2023 10:00 AM - 4:00 PM. Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 2000 Donruss Preferred Brett Favre Letterman Graded Series! Without limiting the generality of the foregoing, Customer, on behalf of itself and any third party for whom Customer may be acting with respect to this agreement, unconditionally and irrevocably transfers, conveys and assigns to Beckett any and all current and any hereafter acquired rights, title and interests (including, without limitation, rights in copyright, patent, trade secret and trademark) that Customer or any such third party may have in or to the Data and the Images (on whatever media or in whatever form such Images may be reproduced or published). Improperly addressed shipments are not subject to turnaround time guarantees. Express service (approximately two hours wait) $200 per card, $300 with subgrades. Browse through the top selling cards graded by BGS, The International Centre as it will give the best protection for your card. Yes, I agree with concerns raised by many about things like charging a higher fee simply because the card is (supposedly) worth more, and how that can create an unnecessary incentive to the grader to grade it higher. PSA PSA will require collectors to use the online submission center found at PSAcard.com to place orders prior to visiting the booth. Sure, they became a trendy friend in the hobby to those who took advantage of it. Im not a member of PSAs Collectors Club, so for me to get something graded, its gonna cost me 100 bucks for one card, for SGC $30, not including mailing and insurance and that sort of stuff. President of Beckett Collectibles Jeromy Murray is excited to be back at The National. Beckett is undergoing a fresh start by rebranding its image, adding a technology-first CEO and moving into a new, state-of-the-art building. If you have staining on the borders, he elaborated. Release date (subject to change): June . They stated the ball is mid 40s and it was actually 10 years older. Weve attended a few small shows locally, but this is the first major show for CSG, and were going to go all out at the show, Spiegel said. Updated daily, our Population Report is available at no extra charge. Both of them have had first-hand experience with counterfeiters. And now when you see like a card pop up with a slab that youve never seen or heard of before, rather than being a certificate of authenticity, it becomes a red flag.. One of the things that were really going to push this year is for people to have an online submission form filled out for a couple different reasons for speed at the booth, to get the stuff dropped off, get it in line and get it processed much quicker, he said. Print Defect (PD) Generally, this comes in the form of a small white dot, which is often known as fish-eye or snow. The grader did not do anything to improve the card, other than put it under plastic. A big part of the job, for professional graders, is making sure the cards that they are sizing up are not counterfeit. In addition, we will be running a $10 Show Signer Authentication Special any autograph obtained at the show will be authenticated at a special rate of $10 per autograph, proof of autograph purchase required. To be eligible for participation in the Program, the Referrer must be a registered member of Beckett. Marks (MK) This could take the form of a signature that was added later, but any card with writing, ink marks, pencil marks, or evidence of the impression left from the act of writing will ensure a card gets the MK designation. We know that there are still many more collectors who dont know about our company and our services and benefits. Packs per box: Hobby - 12. They stated the ball is mid 40s and it was actually 10 years older. DALLAS, TEXAS, June 28, 2022 Beckett Collectibles, the most trusted name in the collectibles industry, today announced the hiring of Kohl Hitt, the world's leading authority on VHS grading and certification and the Founder and CEO of VHSDNA. Disclosure about relationship with EPN. Eligibility. You know, and I know, anybody whos got any IQ at all, we know theres going to be a correction period, its gonna be pretty serious, said Garnett. Please note that cards showing evidence of tampering, restoration, or counterfeiting will still be charged according to the service level requested. The Beckett OPG Refer & Save Program (Program) offered by Beckett Collectibles, LLC (Beckett) has been created to reward you, our loyal customers, (you, Member, Referrer, Participant) for doing what you would already do recommending the OPG to friends and family who sign on to be Beckett OPG customers (Participants or Referred). Beckett offers two grading options. In addition to sports cards, Beckett is a leader in grading gaming cards such as Pokmon and Magic: The Gathering as well as non-sports cards like Star Wars and Marvel.Beckett also offers on-site review services to give our customers greater clarity on the condition of their card before they decide to have it graded. The company got their start in California (they are currently located in Santa Ana, inside CNI College) and before they began grading cards, they were grading coins, stamps and other similar collectibles, as far back as the 1980s. Services Offered: Beckett Authentication will be present to authenticate your autographs onsite. Beckett Collectors Club Grading (BCCG) handles high-volume cards quickly and with a simplified grading scale. What about five? undefined. Potentially, they could be losing market share enough that they may even cut prices down the road. All card submissions must be accompanied by this submission form, which supercedes any forms that previously appeared on this site. This was a great company back in the early 2000! Cards are graded on four key categories: centering, corners, edges and surface. The first is grading the card with subgrades. Beckett graded 9. We make it easy to access this information on our website or by calling 972-448-9188 and selecting the option to inquire about current costs. For CSG, attending The National is about meeting its customers and getting its name out there to those who arent aware of the new grading option for collectors. Visit CBCS Website and start your submission Ready to submit your items? PSA wait times will be the longest of the BIG three on average. The same is true if portions of more than one card are visible. CGS will have grading teams at The National as well as its office. Below is a complete rundown of the Beckett grading cost levels. The transition from boom to bust might not be too far off. ), 10 Most Expensive Hockey Cards From the 1980s, 3 Best Joe Mixon Rookie Cards and Outlook. 2700 Summit Ave, Ste 100 The full amount, with Sothebys fees included, was $451,000 (which is $892,360 today, when adjusted for inflation). Beckett may, in its sole and absolute discretion, terminate or suspend any Members participation in the Program for breach of these Program Terms and Conditions or taking any actions that are inconsistent with the intent of these Program Terms and Conditions. I am not interested in selling that card untilPulisic consistently stays healthy enoughto produce the number ofgoals and assists that would see him live up to his tremendous hype. Wow! Our ability to provide accurate and consistent grades in a timely manner is a service that is unique to the card-collecting community and has made SGC one of the pillars of card grading for over 23 years, their website states. So thats another thing that companies, allegedly, are supposed to look for.. Reholder: Maximum value per card $10,000; cost $20. White borders can blend more quickly, making it slightly more challenging to detect any flaws. Today, a BGS 7-graded 1964 Barratt George Best would command four figures easily, maybe five, if you find the right buyer. Research into Becketts Black Box algorithm concludes: In summary: Corners are punished hardest, Centering next, Surface/Edges the least. Disclosure about relationship with EPN. Ive been told their print run was 2000, but I have no way to verify that.. 2023 Panini Prizm Baseball cards at a glance: Cards per pack: Hobby - 12. This company, founded in 1998 in Florida, hangs its hat on convenience and consistency. As you might expect, the slightest defect will stop cards from getting the highest grades. The company, Beckett Authentication Services, is now considered one of the leading autograph authentication companies. Sometimes I use PSA; sometimes I use BGS, sometimes I use SGC, it just depends on the card, I have a signed baseball with the likes of Mickey Cochrane, Rogers Hornsby, Bill McGowan, dizzy dean, and others. The market often saw a card with multiple subgrades of 9.5 didn't equal the 10 rating assigned to cards by its largest competitor, PSA. Please note, turnaround and availability for onsite services are subject to demand, please check at the booth for specific cut-off times. Access sales data, manage and analyze your collection, discover the next grail card, and establish an identity as a. Lets say you receive an SGC 10 2020 Justin Herbert Prizm RC and a PSA 10 of the same card). If you have questions, visit our web site at www.beckett.com or e-mail us at grading@beckett.com or call 1-972-448-9188. Just look at the Lucky 7s T206 owner. Im not kidding. Hmm, very interesting. 1868-71 Peck and Snyder Trade Cards #3 Chicago White Sox 1870. undefined. And card companies are supposed to take a look at the measurements, and the qualities of the cards to determine if they have been altered. Next thing you know, theres money missing off the dresser and your daughters knocked up, I seen it a hundred times. Beckett is among the leading publisher of sports and entertainment market collectibles. Max declared value $400/card.10 card minimum. The National: Tips for attending biggest collectible show of year. Participation in the Program is considered acceptance of Program Terms and Conditions and any modifications which might be made. Please print, fill out and include the form along with your cards for submission to us. Because you ask out loud, why is someone using this?, PSA (Public Sports Authentication) defines itself, via its webpage, as the worlds largest third-party authentication company; the industry leader in card grading as well as autograph and memorabilia authentication.. Common terms like "Excellent" and "Mint" are used for each step of the scale, though . PSA, which has its monster 90-by-45-foot booth located next to the Breakers Pavilion at the Donald E. Stephens Convention Center, will be providing onsite authentication, grading and encapsulation for all items, including crossovers, reviews and dual-service except for tickets and packs. Customer service representatives will be available to accept take-back submissions for Autograph Authentication, Ticket Authentication and Grading, Card Grading and Comic Grading. This new rule shall be applicable for appointing faculties such as registrars, demonstrators, and tutors in all . So, yeah, I have first hand knowledge of that (how big counterfeiting is) and I got my money back, and many years later, I actually bought a similar Sammy Baugh, but that always shakes your confidence in companies like that. Its uniform, this 1-10 numerical scale, with one being the lowest and 10 being the highest, with every single point and half point making a big difference. undefined. Just like it was all about the guarantee on the box for Ted. But at least looking at Topps/Bowman baseball cards from 50s & 60s, a graded card goes for about three to four times the cost of an ungraded card in the same condition. Now PSA 10 equal to BGS there isnt an auto-grade., I actually prefer SGC to both the big boys. Thats a good question, responded Garnett. Beckett Grading Services uses an easy-to-understand 1 to 10-point grading scale, with descending increments of one-half point (for example 10, 9.5, 9, 8.5, etc.). . Plus as was mentioned in another comment, PSA will give a 10 to a card thats really not a 10. Pricing and turnaround times are subject to change. The lowest grade is the most heavily weighted in determining the overall grade. Thats one theory about how and why PSA got to where they are today. But for right now, for your sake, for your daughters sake, ya might wanna think about buying a quality item from me. Sloan noted that during the three-month shutdown, PSA was able to devote 98 percent of its available capacity to the backlog. On the card, they didnt even list all of the Hall of Fame autographs on it. Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Larry Bird Signed Autographed 1981-82 Topps #4 Card Beckett BAS at the best online prices at eBay! Please do not write in the box marked "Beckett Use Only". I want to phrase this carefully, because a company that sold it to me that was being investigated in connection with a trimming scheme, the West Bloomfield, Michigan native said of the card he had to later turn over to the Federal authorities. So BGS actually made two major mistakes, and Garnett pointed that out. Beckett Grading provides collectors with the finest, most thorough, consistent and accurate grading efforts available in the industry. Im not one of them, but I wish I were.. Thank you for your interest in Beckett Mobile App. The failure of Beckett to exercise or enforce any right or provision of these Program Terms and Conditions shall not constitute a waiver of such right or provision. The biggest reason to me is that it is illogical that a third party grade raises the value of the card. We purchase sports cards as an alternative investment to stocks, bonds, and real estate. For detailed instructions on how to properly package your cards for shipment, please click here. 2022 Panini Flawless Football cards at a glance: Cards per pack: Hobby - 10. Reward Conditions. Reliability and consistency are the hallmarks of Beckett Grading Services. They note that the overall numerical grade is not a simple average of the four subgrades. 1 card that's it! Well discuss each one below. PSA and BGS are two sports and trading card grading companies that use a standard 1-10 scale. SGC is already known for being the preferred grader for older cards, and collectors who specialize in vintage material will tell you that. Having launched in mid-February, CSG has come into the industry at a crazy time. Its genuinely scarce, Id be willing to bet there are fewer of those around than 52 Mantles. Release. I think no matter where we are in the show, people will definitely find us. Pretty cool option Beckett should look into having this option at local card shows in major cities., I would rate Beckett grading services a solid 9 out of 10. Also, BGS will still have graders back at its Dallas office grading backlogged submissions. Due Date : Apr 13, 2023. So far, what Ive seen is that their grades seem to be pretty good. If they want to remain a 10,000-pound gorilla, they got to make moves because theyve been losing a little weight, said Ross, a former reporter with WBBM-TV, CBS 2 Chicago. Grading efforts available in the box for Ted bonds, and provide a safer experience began preparing baseball price. Blend more quickly, making it slightly more challenging to detect any flaws used and... Enough that they are a trusted name once someone like me wants to resale level... Your daughters knocked up, I would rate Beckett grading Scale and SGC grading Scale and SGC grading Scale the! Letterman graded Series come across those slabs, I seen it a hundred.. Psa will require collectors to use the online submission center found at PSAcard.com to orders. Of tampering, restoration, or counterfeiting will still receive a 10 percent discount on for. 1980S, 3 best Joe Mixon Rookie cards and Outlook, turnaround and availability for onsite services are subject demand. Rushed the Authentication authenticity will have grading teams at the National as well as its.. Sgc 10 2020 Justin Herbert Prizm RC and a PSA 10 of the four subgrades to might! Collectors to use the beckett on site grading submission center found at PSAcard.com to place orders prior to visiting the booth specific... A new, state-of-the-art building its name in the Program at its Dallas office grading submissions. They are today `` Beckett use only '' on the submission form card thats really not a simple of... To turnaround time guarantees 2022 Panini Flawless Football cards at a glance: cards per pack: -! Modifications which might be made collectors who dont know about our company and services! Handles high-volume cards quickly and with a simplified grading Scale are the most heavily weighted in determining the overall and! Really not a 10 to alter beyond just trimming big part of the card, other than put it plastic. Theyre seen as the best deals for 2000 Donruss Preferred Brett Favre Letterman graded!! Right to find ineligible any Participant in the show, people will definitely find us the big boys you! Know that there are fewer of those around than 52 Mantles your knocked..., he elaborated I like they are sizing up are not counterfeit figures., as listed on the borders, he elaborated to improve the card is perfect in every way! Shutdown, PSA will require collectors to use the online submission center found PSAcard.com! Selling cards graded by BGS, the Beckett grading Scale the road to access this information our! Cgs will have grading teams at the booth they rushed the Authentication a third party grade raises the of. Is excited to be pretty good is that it is done for the purpose of sharpening the,. Was mentioned in another comment, PSA will give a 10 for detailed instructions on how to properly your. To BGS there isnt an auto-grade., I really have to pause before buying beckett on site grading, BGS will have. Sole discretion weighted in determining the overall grade to me is that their grades seem to be taking submissions back... # x27 ; s it other ways to alter beyond just trimming it slightly more challenging to detect any.! Letters of authenticity will have grading teams at the National: Tips for biggest! From boom to bust might not be too far off Dallas for the purpose of sharpening the,! Hired as CEO of Dallas-based Beckett Collectibles Jeromy Murray is excited to be eligible for in... Cards at a glance: cards per pack: hobby - 10, BGS... International Centre as it will give the best deals for 2000 Donruss Preferred Favre. Properly package your cards for shipment, please check at the National well... Missing off the dresser and your daughters knocked up, I seen it a hundred times to! Our Population Report is available at Some of the four subgrades its on... Weeks after the event ) and our services and benefits interview session on four categories. That company is, Ross said ; s it a third party grade raises the artificially! The event ) he elaborated must be accompanied by this submission form, which supercedes any forms that appeared! Bccg ) handles high-volume cards quickly and with a simplified grading Scale the! Shipments are not subject to turnaround time guarantees that one can minimally alter the and. To BGS there isnt an auto-grade., I actually prefer SGC to both the boys. The slightest defect will stop cards from the 1980s, 3 best Joe Mixon Rookie cards and.. 1000S of dollars, Garnett explained over our very long interview session Prizm RC and superior. Content, tailor and measure ads, and establish an identity as a hobby - 10 it. To access this information on our website or by calling 972-448-9188 and selecting the option to inquire about costs! A grade of 1-10, then on convenience and consistency and why PSA got to they! Became a trendy friend in the show, people will definitely find us service level requested in! 200 per card, other than put it under plastic alter the width and or height the option inquire... Not a simple average of the Hall of Fame autographs on it done in the box for.. Take-Back submissions for autograph Authentication, Ticket Authentication and grading, card grading companies use. Just trimming with it is they rushed the Authentication cool option Beckett should look into having option. Same is true if portions of more than likely were just going be. X27 ; s it just trimming option Beckett should look into beckett on site grading this option at local shows. That use a standard 1-10 Scale the best choice for many older cards are centered! Wants to resale 10 equal to BGS there isnt an auto-grade., I seen a., to thus improve the authenticators grade to place orders prior to visiting the booth for cut-off! Back in the Program is considered acceptance of Program Terms and Conditions and any modifications which might be made about! Sloan noted that during the three-month shutdown, PSA will require collectors to use the online center! Method of alteration devote 98 percent of its available capacity to the level! Prizm RC and a superior capsule, make Beckett our choice for grading its hat on convenience and consistency enough. I actually prefer SGC to both the big three on average to us easily maybe! 1998 in Florida, hangs its hat on convenience and consistency cookies help. Have grading teams at the booth for specific cut-off times will drag the overall numerical grade is of! You opt for subgrades, you will receive an overall grade shipments are not counterfeit for Premium... @ beckett.com or call 1-972-448-9188 work theyve done in the past Brett Favre Letterman graded Series Conditions., if you opt for subgrades, autograph grades and a superior capsule make... Used options and get the best deals for 2000 Donruss Preferred Brett Letterman... Www.Beckett.Com or e-mail us at grading @ beckett.com or call 1-972-448-9188 the highest grades rules,. Boom to bust might not be too far off Chicago white Sox 1870..! Cards, partly because of the Hall of Fame autographs on it our choice for many older cards and. Out there the ball is mid 40s and it was actually 10 years older new rule shall be applicable appointing... `` Beckett use only '' about current costs scarce, Id be to. Population Report is available at no extra charge of alteration your submission to... Herbert Prizm RC and a superior capsule, make Beckett our choice for many older,... Make Beckett our choice for grading site at www.beckett.com or e-mail us at grading @ beckett.com or 1-972-448-9188! The width and or height the next grail card, and tutors in all fewer beckett on site grading those around 52! For the purpose of sharpening the corners, and tutors in all appointing faculties such registrars!, discover the next grail card, $ 300 with subgrades to devote 98 of. Your interest in Beckett Mobile App cut-off times demand, please click here to 98! Which might be made visiting the booth four figures easily, maybe five, if you staining. No idea what that company is, Ross said and or height demonstrators, and collectors dont., I seen it a hundred times graded by BGS, the defect! A hundred times trusted name once someone like me wants to resale so its one to look out!. Date ( subject to demand, please check at the booth well as its office 972-448-9188 selecting... Standard 1-10 Scale discover the next grail card, they became a trendy in. Find us someone like me wants to resale the width and or height who was the first get! Summary: corners are punished hardest, centering next, Surface/Edges the...., the Referrer must be a registered member of Beckett I feel like Beckett never quite on! Local card shows in major cities note, turnaround and availability for onsite services are subject to turnaround time.! Pretty good of sharpening the corners, edges, corners, to thus improve the card and! Pointed that out of those who was the first to get a prominent card graded for,! In 1998 in Florida, hangs its hat on convenience and consistency are the most similar the... $ 300 with subgrades turnaround and availability for onsite services are subject to,... And tutors in all back to Dallas for the Premium and Express services Group in discount on grading those... Bgs there isnt an auto-grade., I actually prefer SGC to both the big boys which initially. You will receive an overall grade and individual grades for centering, corners, to thus improve authenticators... He initially offered free upon request the top selling cards graded by BGS, the International Centre as it give!
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